One odd bird!?

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Cmkwood

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Oct 30, 2019
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I’ve been prebuying a Sonerai II for a buddy of mine the last few days. In doing so I’ve come across some interesting details with this plane I think everyone would like to see. My hope is that someone here has seen these mods or knows a bit more than I. First is a forward swept Mooney type tail. It looks well done but why do it anyway? Mooney did it for stall performance with little effect as far a I know. Next is a fiberglass wing, these wings are heavy, they seem like they are much heavier than the aluminum ones would be. It is said this plane is from England and was brought here around 2012 and got its paperwork then. If you have any info or insight I would appreciate it.
 

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Aviacs

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Mar 16, 2019
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Elmira, NY
Mooney did it for stall performance .....
Original Mooneys were wooden, and supposedly the shape was the easiest to fab and wrap, for all 3 surfaces.
(as a woodworker) I'm not sure that is defining (If the taper is uniform you waste some plywood and material on a bias at both ends with every one, but the structure & wrap if indeed it is even monolithic, does not change significantly). However, most accounts i've read seem to indicate the shape was production factor related, not for aerodynamic reasons.


smt
 

Thaddeus

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Jul 9, 2014
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Valparaiso, Indiana
Interesting. Probably be essential to know how the wings are built. Builder just build a FG spar box and stick the aluminum spar into it? (I'm imagining them shedding in flight!). Or are the wings laid up with a FG covering? (What's the use of that?) . I'm thinking my wings are about 80 pounds, but I haven't weighed them on a scale. Maybe a true "one-offer". Does it fly? Risky business IMHO.
 

Bil438

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Oct 17, 2007
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776
My S2 LS wings are standard and weigh 37 lbs each. Empty with a Jabiru 2200 engine it weighed 529, Now with the J3300 which has 6 cylinder it weighs say 590 lbs. Weight really matters. There comes a point where you can't even take a Jacket and stay under gross.
 

DeadRinger

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Feb 2, 2012
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KAPV
Yikes! Don’t know if I’d be the tester for that unknown plane design. Gotta stick with what’s proven for me.
 

SoneraiKid

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Jun 9, 2017
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Seattle, WA
This is an interesting idea, but I'm not sure of the execution. It doesn't appear that much was changed about the wings. If you are going to use composites why not take advantage of the composites positive attributes. I have a similar idea about composite wings on a Sonerai fuselage for the purpose of going after the C-1a distance record. The Sonerai wing is great at what it does but high efficiency flight is not it.
 

Thaddeus

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Jul 9, 2014
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Valparaiso, Indiana
This is an interesting idea, but I'm not sure of the execution. It doesn't appear that much was changed about the wings. If you are going to use composites why not take advantage of the composites positive attributes. I have a similar idea about composite wings on a Sonerai fuselage for the purpose of going after the C-1a distance record. The Sonerai wing is great at what it does but high efficiency flight is not it.
I don't know about that efficiency aspect. Sonerai wing holds world efficiency record. http://www.worldrecordplane.com
 

Thaddeus

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Jul 9, 2014
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Valparaiso, Indiana
I don't think he changed the wing at all. He cleaned up the draggy parts of the airframe and cooling drag, etc. Put on an adjustable prop, so yes, the most efficient wing.
 

Arron25

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Jan 17, 2006
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As I know the man, and have actually seen SGS up close.. Apart from wet wings... they were standard design wings.. The plane was just built CLEAN using techniques he aquired build the RV he built previously ( it was his second IIL first one built 'to plan') When I saw it it was a very pretty unit.. padded seats carpeted interior, with that 3 blade adjustable prop he developed with Bolly props
 

SoneraiKid

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Jun 9, 2017
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Seattle, WA
There are many times in history where a sub optimal setup holds a record. The wing design is solid, but for an absolute distance record it is not optimal. A clean overall build can win out over 1 stellar piece of the puzzle.
 

WERA611

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Joined
Sep 27, 2018
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Thanks for the reference to the SGS web page. I did not know about this effort and enjoyed the read very much. The details page describes the wing section used. Is this the “standard” Sonerai section?
“Due to the airframe improvements and the NACA 64A212 wing section, even when flown in turbulence SGS displays no nervousness, is directionally unaffected in all axes and has good ride comfort throughout the entire speed range.”
 

danman

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Joined
Jun 20, 2019
Messages
9
Location
Ohio
If thats the case then it opens a lot of potential for all planes. This puts a lot of power in the hands of the builder. Very interesting!
 

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