Tall pilot Sonerai 1 possible mods discussion

[Sb2021]

I’m about 6’3” so I think if I build to plans my knees will hit the spar box and my head will hit the canopy.

I’m considering moving the rudder pedals forward 6 inches or so. Might get tight on my feet.

Also I’m considering increasing the recline of the seat by lengthening the bottom part and moving the stick forward a couple inches. I’ll move the stick by lengthening the torque tube assembly. Then I’ll add a wedge of foam to the seat back. But I guess this will make the knee problem worse.

I’d like to avoid raising the turtledeck but I don’t see how.

Am I missing anything? Are there any tall Sonerai 1 pilots out there?

 

[Tom H]

I am 6' tall. Several years ago I tried to get into a S-1, but could not. Seems my knees would have had to bend backwards to get my legs under the spar box. I possibly could have wormed my way in, but I did not try that hard. Maybe concerned that I would be trapped in there!

 

[Sb2021]

Well, I cadded up the fuse side and took some simple body measurements. It looks like if I push the pedals out mid way between stations 1 and 2, my knees will fit under the spar box. I’ll have to starting working on my sit-and-reach stretches now!

It also looks like I need to raise the turtle deck about 3 inches.

 

[John B]

You could build it as a low wing unless you are dead set on the mid-wing racer look. The low wing sonerai 2 I have is very easy to get in and out of and your knees are above the spar. There reall is no reason a sonerai 1 could not be built as a low wing and would take basically the same mods as what was done to the sonerai 2.

 

[Sb2021]

This is a good idea. I could use a sonerai 2 cowl perhaps. Hmmmm....

You could build it as a low wing unless you are dead set on the mid-wing racer look. The low wing sonerai 2 I have is very easy to get in and out of and your knees are above the spar. There reall is no reason a sonerai 1 could not be built as a low wing and would take basically the same mods as what was done to the sonerai 2.

 

[Sb2021]

I could also mount the rudder pedal cross tube below the lower longerons and have the floor board below that in that area! That would lower my heels and inch and a half or so. And the skin is already away from the lower longerons there as it dips below the gear.

 

[Sb2021]

nope, just worked out the geometry in cad. The rudder cross tube would extend beyond a line from the bottom of the fire wall to the the bottom of the gear, making an ugly bump. Still, I could mount the floor board lower and get an inch.

I could also mount the rudder pedal cross tube below the lower longerons and have the floor board below that in that area! That would lower my heels and inch and a half or so. And the skin is already away from the lower longerons there as it dips below the gear.

 

[Sb2021]

Using geometry from cad, I built a simple cardboard mock up of the seat back. If I push the pedals forward to halfway between station 1 and 2, my legs will fit. I’ll probably do this and raise the turtle deck two inches and call it good.

 

[Gero]

Same experience - 6'0" - years ago i tried to get into a S-1 Midwing. No Way. Even if you get in - you'll never get out again without surgery Bought a S-2L then. If one prefers a single-seater, why not modify an S-2 by omitting the frontseat and modify panel and cowling. Maybe, the S-1 Canopy can be adapted for more sexy shape. Advantage in my view: no changes in structural design (and much more comfort).
Gero

I am 6' tall. Several years ago I tried to get into a S-1, but could not. Seems my knees would have had to bend backwards to get my legs under the spar box. I possibly could have wormed my way in, but I did not try that hard. Maybe concerned that I would be trapped in there!

 

[Steve Stephenson]

I have an old set of plans that says you can adjust the turtle deck as you have described. It will still look badass.

 

[cosmic]

I am 6'2" and decided to gain extra space by going to low wing in my Sonerai 1 and moving the seat to the floor. The change obviously required the controls to be modified but it worked out well and my Sonerai is very comfortable.

 

[tntav8r]

I am 6'2" and decided to gain extra space by going to low wing in my Sonerai 1 and moving the seat to the floor. The change obviously required the controls to be modified but it worked out well and my Sonerai is very comfortable.

Cosmic, how many hours flying since lowering the wing, and how does it handle? Did you use the 3 degree dihedral that the SIIL uses?

Tim

 

[cosmic]

Cosmic, how many hours flying since lowering the wing, and how does it handle? Did you use the 3 degree dihedral that the SIIL uses?

My S1 has done 45 hours. It handles well and the nearest comparison I could make is similar to a Corby Starlet. Dihedral has been set at 1 degree mostly for aesthetic reasons. The undercarriage is longer than standard so wingtip clearance on the ground is adequate.

 

[tntav8r]

Thanks, I built a SII LTS with a friend years ago, (below, and in the gallery) but made it a single seater, and always wondered how a S1 low-wing would perform. Could you post a pic or two or yours?

 

[cosmic]

Thanks, I built a SII LTS with a friend years ago, (below, and in the gallery) but made it a single seater, and always wondered how a S1 low-wing would perform. Could you post a pic or two or yours?

Your SII LTS looks good. Assume the low window above the wing is to improve visibility when landing. There was speculation years ago that an S1 would not work well with a low wing. My experience has been the complete opposite with excellent handling and with a Jabiru 3300 it performs very well. Below is a link to a short iPhone video and a picture.

 

[skycrew]

I am 6'2" and decided to gain extra space by going to low wing in my Sonerai 1 and moving the seat to the floor. The change obviously required the controls to be modified but it worked out well and my Sonerai is very comfortable.

G'day Cosmic. Can you describe your control mods, or provide some pics? I'm 5'11" and fit fine with little room to spare, but I'd like to wear a helmet which is currently impossible. Cheers

 

[Bil4381]

My Sonerai II has a raised turtle deck, raised rudder and fin. The Rudder pedals moved forward to accept 34"+ legs.
I was 6'5"+ when I first flew my Sonerai' These mods are lots of work if the aircraft is completed.

 

[cosmic]

G'day Cosmic. Can you describe your control mods, or provide some pics? I'm 5'11" and fit fine with little room to spare, but I'd like to wear a helmet which is currently impossible. Cheers

My objective was to fit comfortably in the cockpit while trying to retain the streamlined look of the Sonerai. I lowered the seat to the floor and ran the elevator push-rod under the belly of the plane. I was worried this would look bad but you have look very hard to see it and it doesn't look bad anyway. There is an idler arm mounted on the cross member at the rear of the cockpit and from there the push-rod runs inside the fuselage. The ailerons were a different matter. At the time I was doing the controls there was a DR-107 being built alongside so I decided to copy the DR-107 aileron controls. That change has worked out better than I could have wanted thanks to my former partner in the plane, but it was a lot work to put bellcranks etc in the wings. If I was to do it again I would probably stay with the original control design and use a side stick like the Sonex jet does.

 

[skycrew]

G'day Cosmic. Can you describe your control mods, or provide some pics? I'm 5'11" and fit fine with little room to spare, but I'd like to wear a helmet which is currently impossible. Cheers

My objective was to fit comfortably in the cockpit while trying to retain the streamlined look of the Sonerai. I lowered the seat to the floor and ran the elevator push-rod under the belly of the plane. I was worried this would look bad but you have look very hard to see it and it doesn't look bad anyway. There is an idler arm mounted on the cross member at the rear of the cockpit and from there the push-rod runs inside the fuselage. The ailerons were a different matter. At the time I was doing the controls there was a DR-107 being built alongside so I decided to copy the DR-107 aileron controls. That change has worked out better than I could have wanted thanks to my former partner in the plane, but it was a lot work to put bellcranks etc in the wings. If I was to do it again I would probably stay with the original control design and use a side stick like the Sonex jet does.

View attachment 15743

Ingenious, but as you say a lot of work. Thanks for the pic. We’ll be in Brisbane as soon as the boarders are opened as our daughter is there. I’d love to come for a look.

 

[Brisvagas]

Hey Cosmic , I am in Brisbane building a S1 . Any chance I could view yours at some stage ?